Light switches in between transformer & lights

[mpshowalter]

I have a 300 watt (2x150) transformer running my outdoor lighting system. Currently, both circuits and all lights come on at same time and turn off at same time.

Here's what I want to do:

1. I have 3 floodlights on my outdoor putting green that I want to control separately from the rest of the lighting system so I can turn them on only when needed.

2. I purchased a 12 volt fountain pump for a small pond that also requires separate control because it will typically be on during the day and usually not at night.

I would like to keep running entire system off the single transformer, which has plenty of watts for my needs. My thought was to run the main line for one circuit to an outdoor switch box. Using standard light switches, I would then split off three separate circuits to control the pond pump, the putting green lights, and the main yard lights.

Any problems with doing this? Can I have the power from the transformer always on, using only the switchbox to control on/off functions?

Any help appreciated.

[sitelights]

The response below was written before I tested and subsequently installed a product reviewed under the title "Low Voltage Control Devices". This would have been an ideal solution at a nominal cost considering that the special requirements seem perfect for this product. Exasperation.

I strongly recommend that you consider the purchase of separate low voltage transformers to achieve your goal. Low voltage outdoor transformers of modest output (say 75w) are about $30.00 or $35.00 and would allow you to switch them independently with ordinary light switches.

My recommendation is based on the following: ordinary light switches are rated for 15 amps at 120v. Switching a 150w load at 120v is only 1.25 amps but at 12v it is 12.5 amps (watts divided by volts equals amps). While 12v current does not have electrical shock potential the higher amperage can cause hazardous arcing conditions. This is why 12v connections must always be very secure. Arcing can create a serious fire hazard and can burn the skin in an instant. I think adding to the cost of your plan (and switching the primary rather than the secondary) eliminates the risk of doing damage.

[briansmyth9]

You should visit the web site www.ei-products.com, there is a new product that is specifically made for these applications. It's a wireless controller that can control multiple zones off of one remote, and it is inexpensive. The zones can be separated even off of one transformer. Timers are not affected since it does not cut power to them. It can also separately control your 12-volt water pump if it is less than about 12 amps (or 150 watts). All can be installed in less than half an hour and does not require a central controller. This system can be used in all low voltage applications so please check it out and spread the word.

Thanks

[sitelights]

A recent post on "product reviews" titled "low voltage control devices" may be of interest.

[Mike M]

Interesting...

Let's say I have three circuits of outdoor lights in my project. The homeowner wants to control the lights at will, so I use three transformers...

Choices for my install may include: (1) installing a UPB to control three different circuits, or (2) contracting an electrician to wire three switches to three outdoor recepticles (astronomical timers could be used with each transformer in this configuration).

The simplicity of choice (2) is appealing to me, and I wonder what the cost comparisoin would be.

Does anyone have any real-world experience with both options to offer me a good comparison of my choices?

Thanks,

Mike

[sitelights]

While I've read many posts that include the client in the control loop this is contrary to my experience; unless the designer/installer initiates the options for control by the owner it is not an issue. I posit that the trend, if that is what it is, toward owner control is primarilly a sales opportunity and a self-indulgence on the part of the d/i; it is a complication of a simple question: is it necessary or desirable to go beyond the dusk-on, timer-off automatic operation of an outdoor lighting system?

My career in this business has been shaped by my conviction that clients do not need another system to maintain. Unless the client requires a manual control system as part of a micro-management predilection there is no necessity to add their input to your work.

Who really cares if there are 2 or 4 or 6 pathlights that remain on until 2 AM rather than the midnight off of the rest of the system? The energy cost difference is too small to measure and meaningless compared to the SUV in their driveway. Everyone is asleep at that hour anyway; if the issue devolves into a choreographed light show for diurnal creatures what is the point? Go to dusk-to-dawn for that area and move on. Save your lighting wizardy for the effects and spare the client from a boring task.

The energy savings in having the lights manually operated for reduced power company costs is a chimera since the reductions require a "smart" system of control; the owner in this scenario is not "smart" but indifferent.

In an ecological or "green" scenario the lighting would be operated only when desirable; this choice however requires the engaged monitoring by a human being who, after the sale, is not interested. There is a life after landscape lighting and most of us live that life.

My advice is KISS: "Keep it Simple Stupid". Anything beyond the necessity of "user transparency" is bullshit. Take these unnecessary choices away and you do the owner a favor; no one is dazzled by unneccesary footwork: it is a tapdance in a vacuum.

The client only wants what you are capable of providing; the parameters are invariably set by the client-expert interface. Don't offer it and they will not miss it; if they insist on something they know nothing about it is necessary to assert your expertise. You are called to provide expert advice because the potential client knows nothing. Respond accordingly.

[Mike M]

Good points. Parsimony is good for design, build, and service.

The astronomical timer should do the trick. If the client wants a pool area or patio flooded for use, I'll recommend an electrician.

Case in point, my customer has a very nice pool area, landscaped with nice features, so I'll use the lv lights in the perimeter of that area (proximity following code, of course) balanced with the trees and scenes in the background, for a "whole design" as viewed from the panoramic windows, whether or not someone wants to go swimming.

I don't think they'll opt for the floods once they see the finished install.

I have enough to worry about, building my business on the basics, etc., so I'll stay away from upb and switches, at least for now.

Thanks,

Mike

[sitelights]

Swimming pools almost invariably include a underwater niche light installed at the time the pool was built. An automotive headlamp is commonly the light source and the glow from the pool is both a safety feature and lighting for the pool deck; this works well but it is always too bright. A colored lens is usually provided with the pool light to reduce the glare. This snap on lens cover changes the effect from glare to garish.

Sometimes there is simply an on/off switch at the pool panel that can be changed to a dimming switch; the reduction in light output takes care of the glare without changing the lighting effect to blue or purple (the usual colors). Dimming the incandescent source reduces the color of the light to an amber glow that is more natural (and more flattering) as illumination. The dimmer should be of the appropriate type i.e. magnetic of electronic.

Some programmable pool controllers have auxilliary control settings that automate the pool light; this feature may also include dimming capability. Never open the cover of the control cabinet since the electronics can easily be damaged inadvertantly. If the program for the pool light cannot be set or changed using the touch panel only it is advisable to have a service technician perform this work.

[INTEGRA Works]

We often have a need to switch a single light over a fire pit or bbq area, or even a few fixtures on the same branch wire. It is really easily and safely accomodated using a 20Amp marine grade switch located inside a waterproof pvc switchbox. Simple, cost effective and a no brainer.

Have a great day.