best warranties

[Mike M]

I was wondering which of the manufacturers had the best warranties for fixtures.

I see a lot of lifetime or ten years on transformer coils, and was wondering if any company really stood out on fixtures.

Also, how long do installers typically warranty their connections, etc.?

Thanks,

Mike

[SteveP]

Manufacturers vary all over the place with regard to fixture warranties. Without going into details about what each manufacturer promises, here are a few points:

What good is a warranty if the manufacturer will be out of business (or sold) in a few years?

What good is a warranty if you need to pay postage back and forth to the manufacturer to replace or repair a part that costs less than the postage?

What good is a warranty if the fine print of the warranty is voided because you actually installed the fixture?

What good is a warranty if you must send in the bad fixture and wait weeks to get it back?

What good is a warranty if your reputation with the homeowner is damaged because the fixture failed prematurely.

I don't mean to completely discount the value of a warranty, but it is a fact that many manufacturers use warranties as a marketing ploy. In reality, it's not manufacturers that get hurt from unrealistic warranties - it's the contractor.

The best warranty is the one that is unwritten - it is the relationship of trust that exists between the few good manufacturers and their customers. In my five years with one such manufacturer, I know of zero times when any warranty request was even questioned.

The best approach is to understand for yourself the expected life of fixture materials and components. Decide if you want a fixture that will last 6 months, 1 year, 5 years or longer. Basing your buying decision on that knowledge will be a better guide to quality/cost comparisons than judging by warranties.

[Mike M]

The best approach is to understand for yourself the expected life of fixture materials and components.

Maybe, in general, but the reason I ask is that I purchased some heavy duty brass fixtures with no spec's, paperwork, warranty, etc. They appear well-made, they are nice and heavy, and they are made out of brass.

I notice a lot of brass and bronze fixtures on the market, but unless I buy them and throw them in dirt for a few years, I really won't know. And I'm mostly stuck just staring at computer images, since I can't even examine the fixtures in person.

I guess what you mean to say, is that there are other "quality indicators" in addition to warranties, such as brand reputation, a UL #, architectural spec's, company philosophy, company experience/specialization in outdoor lighting, etc. I should forget about the fixture (which in my case is usually a jpeg image) and read an annual report from the company. Better yet, I should fly to the manufacturing facility and take a tour, and interview the people who work there. Just kidding about the last part.

I was recently told to buy fixtures from company "A", but the only good fixtures from them are "x, y, and z." What the heck?

I'm at the beginning stage of my business, and I want to leave the metalurgy and chemistry to the product engineers. I'll read the technical explanations, but in the end I'll have to rely on trust and reputation.

Mike

[Paul]

Mike, there are several very good manufactures out there that stand behind there products. One thing to be wary of are those that require you to install only "their" product and do it "their way". Is it a repair warranty or a replacement warranty. Do you have to send it in or can you give it to your distributor?

I use products from several different manufactures (no manufactures make every fixture that you may need) and all of them offer great warranties that allow me to replace the fixture in question with a brand new one (not a repair) and all I have to do is take it (or they will pick it up when delivering) to my distributor.

Look for a manufacture that has been around for many years and are involved in the industry as a whole. Are they members of lighting organizations that deal with our industry? (AOLP, ALA) Are their products UL or ETL listed?

The manufactures that will stand behind their products are those that have been around long enough to have done just that.

[LowVoltPro]

As most of you can tell by now I am prety much a Unqiue Lighting guy for lots of reasons. One of them is the warranty they offer. I look at a warranty as a death certificate, if you tell me you only have a 5 year or 10 year that means when the light fails in 10 years dont call us. Unique was one of the first companies I noticed offering life-time unconditional warranties on their transformers and well lights. Then they released the Odyssey line of Solid Brass fixtures and those too came with a Lifetime Warranty. As a person who installs over 1000 lights a year I do have situations where lights fail, sometimes its my guys fault other times the light just takes a crap and a lens cracks or something like that. It is a pain Steve P to have to actually cut the light out of the ground to send it in but do you expect the company to come out and cut it out for you and re-install it?? I make opportunitys out of my warranty issues. I go back to the job I take care of the light with a smile on my face and then I discuss upgrade options in hopes of adding to those existing systems. I also try and always set up a maintenance contract. Bottom line is there is no perfect warranty out there but it says something for the company who is willing to lifetime warranty a product you stuff in the ground. Most likely you will be limited to more expensive brass lights for the lifetime warranty becuase lets be honest, aluminum will fail at some point, maybe not on your dime or the origional homeowners but it will fail. Here on the coast of California installing aluminum is like begging for a problem!

[runninglts]

I totally agree with most said particularly the part of examining quality level of a fixture first hand and knowing your metals. But he part that gets a bit harder to judge is well engineered heat dissipation and socket quality. It doesn't do anyone any good if the body holds up for 10+ years but quality 10,000 hr lamps routinely fail or sockets disintegrate.

One of the brands we use is noted to be the very best quality in the industry -- beautiful stuff and a price tag to go with it -- but had a socket fail within 4 months. This cost us much cycle time and created perception problems with a potentially valuable client.

And by the way, we found there absolutely no profit in running around doing replacements under manufacturer warranty. These occurrences are just drags on your business in more ways than one.

Our position is not to look so much at the stated warranties but to buy/sell durability based on logic and informed judgment whenever the targeted budget allows --and when it doesn't, undersell longevity and warranty.